Comments on: I want to be a leader in the church

By: Trevor Ruby

Trevor Ruby — Sat, 22 Jan 2011 16:36:09 +0000

God Help Us! Please pray for me brother, I am sure that i often fall into the trap of selfish motives. I need the Lord help with this. Pray that he shows me if this desire to preach of mine is built on the wrong foundation.

By: David Murray

David Murray — Fri, 24 Dec 2010 01:46:44 +0000

Fred: You make a good point. We wrestled with this issue in Scotland. The end result was that the Church paid some and the student paid some – although local congregations also contributed at times. The difference between pastors and other “professionals” (at least in Scotland) is that while Seminary credits cost the same as Law and Medical credits, pastors will never be paid a similar salary to recoup the costs. as lawyers and doctors can. I think that’s why churches have stepped in to help. Jeff: I agree 100%. I much prefer men to be tested first. It is the biblical way. The problem is that the church is sometimes not willing to give that opportunity until they have had seminary training. Bit of a chicken and egg situation.Daniel: (1) You’re right, we are all a mixture of motives to one degree or another. And yes, a man can start out well-motivated and degenerate over time. The question is really where does the major balance of motives lie. And do we hate, repent of, and fight against the more ignoble ones.(2) I think it is imperative for a pastor to enjoy studying. If he doesn’t, it’s unlikely that he’s called. But too many pastors want to just stay in their studies. And too many are attracted to ministry because they want to study and study and study. Study is not the end, it is the means to an end. Do you have someone you can talk to about your own situation? I would just be very honest with a pastor (ideally), elder or mature Christian friend. And pray it through with them over a period of time.

By: jeff weddle

jeff weddle — Thu, 23 Dec 2010 17:46:17 +0000

The best cure for a desire for leadership in the church is to be given leadership in the Church. The tests, temptations, challenges, discouragements, defeats and suffering that will arise will show soon enough whether the desire was real. We must be careful not to disqualify people who learn by doing, because no seminary, volunteer work, or anything else adequately prepares a man to do this job.

By: Daniel Biddle

Daniel Biddle — Thu, 23 Dec 2010 05:08:31 +0000

I have a question or two for you, Mr Murray, if you have time to answer. I have finished a four year course of ministerial study, but I am reluctant to seek a ministry position until I am absolutely 100% confident that it is God’s will. I can only say with confidence that the Lord has/had called me to study, but not necessarily to the ministry. Now I am at this stage, my thoughts much upon the ministry, but I don’t feel I am (or maybe ever will be) any closer to certainty. Many of the points of the first list I can say characterise my desire; but yet at the same time, some of those on the second list might characterise my desires. Thus I am at an impasse; I guess really I am looking for advice.1. If a man has pure and God-glorifiying desires at the beginning of his ministry, is there not still a danger of self-glorifying desires creeping in later on in that man’s ministry? Should truly called man never have a selfish desire in relation to his ministry?2. Though of course i admit the selfishness of the points of the second list, is it always wrong to (in some respects) be selfish? For example, is it wrong to desire to read and study? Or is it always wrong to seek fulfilment in your life by service to God? If you could take the time to answer my questions I would greatly appreciate it.

By: Fred Jonkman

Fred Jonkman — Wed, 22 Dec 2010 18:46:02 +0000

I do think one of the errors made by the church or denominations is that they give free rides to seminaries, or in other words, they pay the seminary costs and living expenses for the “students”. To test if it is a real “desire”, it would be good to see that person pursue this desire by paying for his education as all other professions young Christians have to do to fulfill their desires in a calling. When does the church pay for higher education for others which would be legitimate callings also?

By: Joel Zehring

Joel Zehring — Tue, 21 Dec 2010 18:44:00 +0000

I’m intrigued by the “forced-into-ministry” model that you describe.It strikes me that I don’t need permission to do any of the things on the “God-glorifying desires” list. If I want to join God in his work, I start by praying and serving where God leads.If I want people to pay me for joining God in his work, that’s a different story. Who decides that I deserve monetary support or a even a full salary for my service? In America, it seems that many would-be-pastors decide unilaterally that they want to be paid, often without demonstrating any aptitude for ministry and leadership in a volunteer capacity.What if would-be-pastors started as volunteers, and the believers they served sent them to seminary to enhance their ministry knowledge and skills for the strengthening of that local body? Perhaps the number of “ministerial corpses” would decrease, along with the number of pastors leaving seminary shackled to student loan debt.